Scaling Issue: Players and Enemies don't scale properly

Problem you’re trying to solve
Fundamental reason for why players could do level 50+ content at level 15-25 was an issue with scaling. Currently, players scale in power much faster than enemies do. For the first 10-15 levels, the scaling appears to be pretty good, but as soon as we hit Wasteland dungeons and start getting T3-T4 loot with tons of stats on it, our power leapfrogs that of all the enemies in the game. This is how the scaling is currently:

level-curve

How you currently feel about this in-game and how you think you should feel
In MMORPG’s it’s critical that players and mobs scale in power and difficulty around the same curve. Early game players should be a bit stronger than the mobs, so that new players can learn the game without being frustrated with failing missions or not being able to complete boss rooms. Game should start easy and then get more challenging as you get into the later levels. Towards the later levels is when players want a challenge and the mobs should be a bit stronger than the players so we have to work together and use skill to defeat them. This keeps us wanting better items to try and close the gap a bit so we can defeat the higher level enemies and do the end game content. This is what makes the game fun.

Any ideas you have on how things could be improved, fixed, or add more fun to the experience
Player and enemy power scale should look like this:

level-curve-correct

There are multiple ways to fix scaling so it looks more like the graph above.

  1. Reduce the stats on items and cap them based on item level.

  2. Too much loot in high level dungeons and not enough in lower level dungeons. It’s too easy to find items with a ton of stats once we hit 25-35 dungeons because so much of it drops. I like the drop rate of legendary rarity and above, that’s not the issue, it’s just too much uncommon/rare/epic stuff dropping in higher level dungeons that makes it easy to find loot with good rolls and high stats. And on the flip side, need to drop more uncommon/rare/epic stuff in lower levels. The amount of loot in higher level dungeons just makes no sense whatsoever…

too-much-loot

  1. Make player level effect the power of skills along with stats. I always thought this was the case because it makes sense but apparently level has nothing to do with power of skills. This may or may not be needed if stats from items are adjusted properly.

  2. Increase the hp/power of mobs at higher levels and give them natural regeneration. Add diminishing returns to players skills: https://forum.bigtime.gg/t/suggestion-to-stop-level-15s-from-clearing-50-dungeons

About diminishing returns on player skills. Please take the time to do this and make it so oil trap and time bubble and those skills work on mobs 10+ levels higher than you, they should work, they should just be less effective for every level over 10 until they do very little where time is better spent leveling up. I was credited with this but never suggested for them to not work on mobs over 10 levels. Many players were upset with me over that, so I thought I would clear that up.

For complete list of what needs to be fixed to make the game fun again, see this post: https://forum.bigtime.gg/t/focus-on-fun-next-patch

11 Likes

This post is exactly true. At level 22 I found a belt with 40 int. That 40 int is a ton when it comes to converting to damage on a chrono or SB bomb build. These changes IMHO need to be implemented before anything else as all efforts to balance the game are going to come from first balance player damage and health to mob damage and health

2 Likes

To further go into depth all stats should be level capped IMHO something like this.

lvl1-10 int rolls from 0-10
lvl11-20 int rollls from 8-21
lvl21-20 int rolls from 15-35

The increaseing gap allows for more of a grind without punishing the player for being higher level. also allowing for god tier rolling the mid game to still hold wieght further into the end game.

If done to the best scale this would also be influnced by rarity ie a rarity % inc so uncommon gives a 5% inc in stats and for example mything gives 30% increase in stats

3 Likes

Yup all true. I think its clear now its just not fun being a lvl 15 or 20 or even 25… getting something with +40 any stat.

1 idea is items having a drop rate for ranges so example

Common helmet drops gear with 0 boosted stats

Uncommon helmet drops gear with 1-3 int str dex etc

Rare helmet drops gear with range 4-8 int str dex etc

Epic helmet drops 8 - 13
Legendary 13 - 20
Mythic 20 - 35
Exalted 40 - 65

And to curve the issue of low level but high rarity also recieving those ranges is scale down by lvl… so if a lvl 10 monster drops an exalted ring it obviously shouldnt have 40-60 stat… but only 10% which would be fair since low lvl will only get 4 - 6 stat boost from exalted item.

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I pretty much elaborated on @Kingperrin1 lol.

I think a lot of us are just on the same page at this point

2 Likes

Definitely well-thought out and accurate Blazo. The graphs were great…Thanks for presenting this info in such an accurrate and logical manner.

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